Is KNBR really the No. 1 sports station in America?

Bay Area Stats Guy August 17, 2012

If you spend anytime listening to KNBR, I am sure you’ve heard the boasts that they are “The Sports Leader” and that they are “America’s No. 1 sports station.” It has always been confusing as to what this really means and it made me wonder if there was some measurement out there that backed it up.

If you read the radio wars posts at all you already know that KNBR dominates the Bay Area. But again, the boast isn’t simply that they’re No. 1 in the Bay Area … but that they’re No. 1 across the entire country. So, with the beauty of the internet and the availability of Arbitron numbers it provides, I decided to take a look at where KNBR actually falls among its Sports Radio brethren nationwide (all ratings and listener information via Radio-Info.com from the May to July period).

First, let’s take a look at the rankings based on a pure number of listeners. San Francisco is the fourth-largest radio market so this should help KNBR against the smaller market rivals. Among the top 50 markets, KNBR comes in third place in average listeners over the last three months with 916,800. The only stations listened to by more people were WFAN-AM (1.6 million) and WEPN-FM (1.2 million) in New York.

That’s a pretty impressive showing, considering that the size of the New York market is 2.6 times larger than the San Francisco market.

Now we will look at things from a radio share perspective. This should allow some of the stations in smaller markets a fighting chance against the big boys. It should also paint a clearer picture of how thoroughly each station dominates its market.

Among the top 50 markets, KNBR ranks third over the last three months, with an average rating of 4.8. KNBR was beat by WXYT-FM (6.9) in Detroit and WGFX-FM (4.9) in Nashville.

Taking a look at these two measures, KNBR measures out at third place. Taking a simple average of rankings they move into second place behind WXYT (which was first in ratings and fourth in total listeners). Often it is best to look at the simplest measure, but this time I want to dig a little deeper and try to take into account the amount that each station was better than average, a RATING+ along the lines of an OPS+ to get a better idea of where everyone stands.

To do this I looked at the average ratings and listeners for each station in the sample, then I compared each station to that average to see where they ranked. KNBR’s ratings were 3.0 times the average and their average listeners were 3.8 times the sample average.

The next thing to look at was how to properly combine the two. I didn’t want to take a simple average, because to me ratings tell a bigger part of the story than simple number of listeners when comparing across markets. However, I don’t want to ignore the total listeners because that tells us something important as well. So in the end I decided to weight ratings at twice as important as listeners. This may be incorrect — if you feel so, let me know in the comments and I can maybe tell you what it would be with your preferred method.

Here are the top 10 sports radio stations in America according to my RATING+ method over the last three months:

Station	Market	RATING+
WXYT-FM	Detroit	395
WFAN-AM	NY	356
KNBR-AM	SF	327
WEEI-FM	Boston	284
KDKA-FM	Pittsburgh	244
WEPN-FM	NY	237
WGFX-FM	Nashville	227
WIP-FM	Philadelphia	211
KIRO-AM	Seattle	194
WBZ-FM	Boston	192

If you are interested, “The Game” posted a RATING+ of 57, and KNBR 1050 posted a RATING+ of 53, ranking 42nd and 47th respectively among the 75 stations in the sample.

This is far from a definitive study; from looking at the ratings over the last year I am fairly certain that we are looking at the ratings peak of KNBR while I am unsure about the stations I am comparing it to. Perhaps they are more football dependent or are able to maintain very consistent ratings through out the year.

Regardless, when it comes to America’s No. 1 station, KNBR is in the conversation … but it falls short of the top spot by each measure, at least during the summer months at the height of baseball.

About the Author

Scott "Bay Area Stats Guy" Willis is a life long sports fan who has a fascination with the statistical side of things. He has been writing on these here internets about the San Francisco Giants since 2010 at Crazy Crabbers and at Bay Area Sports Guy since 2011 but if you dig real deep some of his high school newspaper stuff is out there too. You can follow him on twitter @BAStatsGuy or Google +Scott Willis

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43 comments

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Cathy

On many occasions I have gone online to seek out the opposing teams flagship station & listen in. I am a pretty objective person & I can overlook some homerism, but before you judge our local stations I suggest you listen in across the nation. After doing so you should totally appreciate the local talent on KNBR. The same goes for our Giant's broadcast team. Seriously, go to the opposing teams broadcast & just listen.....I guarantee you will have more respect for our guys. We not only have a good broadcast team, but an over abundance of them. How much longer can we expect to hang on to Dave? We are so completely spoiled that we truly do not realize how good we have it. The talent level in the Bay Area is over the top (except for one broadcaster who must be very uncomfortable sitting on that big wad of cash he claims to always carry around). Even LA has lousy sports radio. Wake up & smell the roses.

Danny

Surprised Sports 620 KTAR in Phoenix didn't get in the ratings.

BA Stats Guy

They are ranked number 20.

Shannon

KNBR has the ratings because they have the broadcast rights. Their shows are terrible. Murph & Mac - One's condescending and in his own little Giant paradise. The other is just not very sharp and the show is about whatever they happen to be interested in. Kate knows what she's talking about and shares strong opinions. Pcon is ready to move on, he used to be entertaining, but his increasing negativity towards homers, those who are listening, is getting to be too much. Gary - Used to be entertaining, annoying. Larry has knowledge but a blowhard. 12-3 - refuse to even turn the station on between these hours, no exception. Terrible Tom - shame Ralph is gone, i actually could bear him the last couple of years. Tom is out there and Eric makes my ears bleed. In stating this, I have to say I paid to get xm so I don't have to listen to this crap anymore.

Fitz's Future Unemployment Check

Partially because of the broadcast rights, but also because the game doesn't really offer much better of a choice. The game's morning zoo is a bit better than M&M, but not exactly by a wide margin. The Wheelhouse is worse than Radnich, but obviously better than F&B. Tolbert>>>>>>>Tierney and its not even close. Townsend blows away sportsphone though. But throughout the day, its mostly a draw.

Otis Byrd III

What about Damon's show on KNBR 1050, and Sportsphone when Ray Woodson hosts it? Damon's show is the best show on KNBR right now, and Ray Woodson isn't that bad now that he's kind of the unofficial host of Sportsphone now. Yeah, I agree that overall, KNBR isn't really that good. I agree with you on Murph and Mac, even though Brian Murphy pretty much runs that show, while Paulie Mac really brings nothing to that show, other than his random songs about Giants players. Som of them are funny, some of them have catchy tunes, but a lot of them are kind of a joke. LOL. At least the Lincecum one has caught on. haha. I agree with you on Gary. Gary used to be entertaining and he was good back in the 90's and early 2000's, but like you said, now he's kind of annoying. He can still be entertaining at times, but he's eh.... Krueger is actually pretty good. The guy is very prepared, and is probably one of the hardest workers on KNBR. Krueger probably scares Gary with his knowledge. Krueger really is taking advantage of his return back to KNBR. As I said in the other thread, the Fitz and Brooks Show was better back in the day. A lot of that might’ve been because they had no competition, and this was the best sports radio talk show to listen to in the Bay Area between Noon to 3 on weekdays, at one time. Now, they have stiffer competition with a better show on 1050 in Damon’s show, and you have the last two hrs. of The Wheelhouse (Jon Lund) and the first hr. of Tierney’s show on 95.7. Now, the Fitz and Brooks show becomes like the third best option of sports radio talk shows to listen to here in the Bay Area on weekdays from Noon to 3. The Fitz and Brooks Show isn't as good as it once was though. Tom is ok, and I do agree he's out there at times. As I said in the past, Byrnes is better as a fill-in host. There's times when he can be good and make sense, but overall, Byrnes is eh. But yeah, KNBR isn't as good as it once was though.

ReggieWrite

Is KNBR really the No. 1 sports station in America? The short answer is NO. They have impressive ratings in this market but this obviously isn't the biggest market. They way I interpret their calling themselves “The Sports Leader” and “America’s No. 1 sports station.” is as examples of "puffing." Puffing is a legal term that refers to exaggerated claims related to the promotion of a product which are not necessarily legally binding. For example Joe's Diner may say they serve "the world's best apple pie", which undoubtedly isn't true but consumers kind of understand that and can't sue Joe after proving that someone else provides even better pie. Likewise, KNBR might have some flimsy statistics that could show they are the number 1 in the country on some particular category but primarily I think it's just a case of puffing. The slogans are arguably exaggerated examples of self promotion.

Stan

But what the bay area COULD have in sports talk? KNBR is no.7,756. Most of KNBR's contracted hosts have become experts at killing time,not worthwhile talk.

3rdKing

except these are fluctuating numbers....#2 to new york is #1 by a mile

Stan

..And your study shows how strong the east coast bias is..because we ALL know-libs and conservatives,that ESPN ignores the Giants and west coast other then the Lakers/Dodgers. Its beyond money..and just a real chip on shoulder, east coast snobbery.

Stan

I thought EVERYBODY knew about east coast bias..but the resident neo nazi voters show why we had Nixon Reagan and the Bush family as presidents..

Tom

Repeat this study after the baseball season and I would be very suprised to find KNBR on any national top ten list

Otis Byrd III

Eh, yeah, even though having the 49er and Warrior games aired on KNBR in the fall and winter, should count for something, and help KNBR's rating stay high.

Fitz's Future Unemployment Check

Considering KNBR is happy to throw the Warriors onto the 1050 wasteland on a whim, I somehow doubt they're getting very good ratings. The Niners are only once a week.

TommyJ

It's like guys who bag on Kruk and Kuip (who I can't stand when they go into off-field garbage like "gamer babes" and "eliminate me Kruk", but are great between the lines broadcasters). K & K while not everyone's favorite are plenty more objective than those baseball broadcasters in Chicago, St Louis, etc. BTW even though I'm not a big Tiereny or Urban fan, they were a pretty good team on The Drive this week. It's like they cancel out each other's negative traits (no so much for Lund; he should be toast).

Blaster

I would love to comment on how awful the Tierney/Urban pairing was. But to be honest, the IDEA of it was so repulsive to me that I got re-aquainted with my punk CD (mp3) collection from my youth. Black Flag>>>>>>>>Tierney/Urban. My gut tells me that Townsend is going to be paired up with Jackass Tierney. Rick Tittle will take over Townesnd's show. It's already starting to happen.

I am totally hoping that they keep Urban and Tierney together. For me, they are the worst two hosts on the Game. Having them together would be great because I could listen to other shows and not worry about hearing either one. Stellar move by the Game. Now, if the could pair Brazil with Lund, or just have Scott Reiss take over Lund's spot, we'd really be onto something.

TierneySucks

AJ, . I was thinking exactly the samething. Once I heard that Tierney and Urban was pairing for a week. I didn't even bother to turn on to the game on that slot.

Otis Byrd III

I agree. Tierney and Urban weren't a bad team this week. 95.7 should just go with that pairing for a while, until they get tired of each other. As we've been talking about, why does 95.7 have to find Tierney a co-host from outside, when they have decent options in house? Plus, who knows if the guys they tried out, can commit to doing a show like this long-term? I mean no offense to these guys, but can you honestly see Lincoln Kennedy (even though he's the right guy for the job since he has another radio show), Jon Ritchie, Rod Woodson, Ric Bucher, or Gary Payton co-hosting with Tierney ful-time? It's hard to envision that, unless they were willing to do it on a fill-in basis or something. But yeah, 95.7 has options in house. Even though talking baseball is Urban's strong suit, he actually does have good knowledge of other sports, even though the show flowed better when they talked baseball.

"Even though talking baseball is Urban’s strong suit, he actually does have good knowledge of other sports" Actually, he doesn't. He's serviceable on NBA and just slightly better on NFL. He's completely lost on the NHL. The guy is just too focused on MLB. And that's ok if you keep him on his Saturday gig and leave him there. The problem is that they overuse him to the point that I'm convinced he has naughty photos of Entercom brass. When do they change the call letters to KURB?

Fitz's Future Unemployment Check

Tierney and Urban were a dumper fire's idea of a dumpster fire.

Fitz's Future Unemployment Check

While I think KNBR does suck, there's some reasons for this being what it is. I figured if you looked at the rankings they'd be top ten in the country. I figured a station from LA, Dallas or Boston might be ahead of them. Keep in mind, the average listener is not some "sports talk radio connoisseur" like everyone here. They want to hear about their team and don't care about much else. They don't listen for hours on end. They tune in, tune out and tune in again. The battleground for ratings is fought for these types, not for the types that listen a lot and for a long time. The shitty tendencies of KNBR will grind less on the casual listener than on the regular listener. Second, if you think KNBR is so awful, take a listen to sports talk radio in Denver, Minneapolis, Kansas City, or any other mid market. Generally you get local stuff from 6am-7pm, sometimes more and sometimes less. You'll get lots of time from ESPN, Fox Radio, etc. You'll get full segments talking about fishing or something like that (no joke). When they're local, you'll get massive homer that would make Bob Fitzgerald look downright critical of the Warriors. So really, count your blessings. You could have it like me and only get really crappy programming on the radio and have to spend all your radio listening time on the Game or KNBR's website. Frankly, after hearing what most of the rest of the country has to offer, KNBR is a breath of fresh air.

Bay Area Stats Guy

What is your local station?

Fitz's Future Unemployment Check

It's ever changing. I travel a lot for work, this week it's 100.3 The Fan in Minnesota. Absolute garbage. The morning show here is some dude called "meat sauce" and it's the epitome of the morning zoo. It makes M&M and the Dibley zoos look like the most serious sports analysis outside of stat nerds like football outsiders. I was in Denver the last few weeks, same deal. 104.3 the Fan, also complete garbage that makes KNBR look freaking amazing. The level of homerism on both stations is beyond insane. The Minnesota one on Monday had one of their "analysts" on proclaiming the Vikings had the best player at 8/11 defensive positions compared to teams in the NFC north. Some nobody LB I've never heard of >>> Briggs/Matthews.

Steve

The Game won't beat KNBR until it picks up another team or two's radio rights. Yes hosts matter, but if you're a 9ers and Giants fans, you have no real reason to ever change the dial. A's fans won't listen to KNBR and chances are they only need to tune in during game time.

Stan

I have to take you for your word. Even three sounds a bit high. And dont worry,I sure dont expect KNBR to answer any query on where they stand and with what proof. Only PBS would do that.

RocketJockey

Well that was a waste of time and the worst ratings analysis I've seen. Did you ever think that it might be worth your time to contact KNBR and ask them what they mean by "America's #1" instead of making your own senseless ratings metric?

Stan

I haven't confused a thing. Read your 131 post. It was as we call it a "hater post"..you said Stats guy post "was a waste of time" "The worst analysis you've ever seen" " And "a senseless metric rating"..its right there in black and white..or now in pink and white as its gained readers since I pointed it out. Don't blame me if you cant stand up to the crowd. Have a nice weekend!

RocketJockey

But Stan, my tone changed. It was condescending then it was apologetic but the condescending part you mention was in a later post. The ratings metric was "senseless" that's criticism. Criticism is covered under "Hate the Game not the player" for the classic "haters" out there. And damn son now you've gotten all apologetic to me with your have a nice weekend. -Insert something about confidence, wisdom and convictions here-

Stan

You notice rocket man..I posted a real answer,with REAL quotes and never called you idiot or troll? I gave you a man answer. I myself usually get the little boy answers as above described.

Bay Area Stats Guy

I have an email into KNBR on the question. In the mean time I thought that looking at the very basic numbers would be able to suffice. They certainly do have one of the top stations but the TOP? Well the numbers just don't suggest that is the case.

Stan

How many days have t go by BAStatsG before you consider no answer from KNBR as no answer?

RocketJockey

ADepending on what #1 means. A look at the ratings system and how it's broken down into demographics and viewed by stations should give one a broader view. Also it should be clarified that #1 has many meanings several of which aren't normally required to substantiated in advertising. You jumped to the conclusion that they meant ratings and then only examined two ratings categories. Sometimes it's best to wait for a reply.

RocketJockey

Well Stan, you've confused the posts and you can't tell how "senseless" was used. Anything else you'd like to share from your font of wisdom or has it all dried up?

Stan

Not to rub it in..but c'mon your first post sure didn't sound like the last two!.."senseless" "a waste of time"..and the condescending "Why not call KNBR?"...ya dope! Might as well have talked about his ma...

RocketJockey

Wow that's how you read it? I couldn't give a rats ass about a thumbs up or a thumbs down. I do however like congratulating people when they take the time to see their work for what it is. This was nothing but some gentle criticism for a writer that I have otherwise enjoyed in the past. I hope he continues to try and improve his writing so that he can displace any of the questionable sports writers in the Bay Area.

Stan

lol,Rocket Jockey crumbled as the disapprove votes added up. From ripping you..to wishing you cheers and tally -ho! You got to have confidence and wisdom to buck the crowd RJ...lol. you need more of both.

RocketJockey

I totally agree and am glad to see the acknowledgement. Assumptions and limitations of data are all too often ignored in favor of opinions. Calling attention to them in the body of a work can turn a bad article into a considered, thought out piece of writing. Should your email fail to get a response please consider picking up a phone they can still do wonders in the business world. Cheers

BA Stats Guy

Them saying number one implies (at least to people I have talked to) that they are most listened to. They could semanticly say that number one means something else but without them qualifying it certainly seems (at least to me) they are implying they are the most listened to. As for what I chose to examine, well that is a limitation of the publicly available data. I would love to have more data to look at and fully understand the limitations of what conclusions I can draw but I will do the best I can with what I have. If someone wants to pass along the data I would love to examine it until then I will make do with what I have while acknowledging the limitations.

Either way, the Game still has a lot of changes to make if it wants to ever make a dent and challenge KNBR in any way.

Quest Dibley

Once THE GAME lands the Warriors and pick up the Raiders next year it'll be lights out for KNBR!

Fitz's Future Unemployment Check

The Warriors won't help their ratings much, and for some reason I don't think KNBR will really be that sad to see them go. The Raiders? They would have to pry them away from Live 105, that would account for a once a week bump and they already talk way more Raiders during the week yet it doesn't move the needle. KNBR holds the biggest ratings getter and the second biggest one, they'd need to pry one of those if they ever wanted a chance to catch KNBR. In other words, fat chance.